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540 + FF + Statux(Flightbox)

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rangerb3 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 05 Jun 2020 at 8:38pm
Ok, I have this new tool(IFD 540) in my panel and was trying the flight plan transfer to Foreflight which works good as long as I’m on the same wifi network with the IFD. My problem is that I’m usually connected to my flightbox WiFi so I can get my traffic and weather on FF...so, what’s the best way to continue with FF/Flightbox and still be able to transfer flight plans between the IFD & FF?

Is the solution to connect the IFD and FF to my Flightbox WiFi network that way, they are all on the same network?


Edited by rangerb3 - 05 Jun 2020 at 8:45pm
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chflyer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chflyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 4:28am
Yes, either that or configure the Flightbox to connect to the IFD wifi network. Just remember that whichever route you use, you will be depending on that wifi access point to always be active. If you use the Flightbox as your wifi access point, then if it goes offline for some reason, you'll lose the IFD/FF connectivity. The IFD will always be online unless the aircraft has an electrical failure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 8:08am
From what I understand, the FlightBox (really a repackaged Stratux DIY box) cannot connect to other networks. It has to provide the access point. You can configure the IFD to access the FlightBox network and then connect the iPad to it too. Everything then works to get ADS-B in on FF and to transfer flight plans to and from the IFD. 

However, Vince is right that you are depending on the device providing the access point for all the devices to talk to each other. I have a FlightBox and have built a couple of Stratux devices. I do not find them very reliable. I've lost a few SD cards, and if you don't have the right USB cable, you can have all kinds of reliability issues. To me, these are cool toys, kludged together from several general-purpose components (Raspberry Pi computer, software defined radios, etc.). They use a lot of power and have many failure points at each interconnection. I might trust a purpose built portable, like a Stratus or Sentry, but I don't trust a Stratux derivative to be a reliable network access point that all my other devices would have to depend on for interconnection.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 2:09pm
Originally posted by HenryM HenryM wrote:

From what I understand, the FlightBox (really a repackaged Stratux DIY box) cannot connect to other networks. It has to provide the access point. You can configure the IFD to access the FlightBox network and then connect the iPad to it too. Everything then works to get ADS-B in on FF and to transfer flight plans to and from the IFD. 
I figured in order to get everything talking I'd have to setup the Flightbox as the hub with the IFD & FF as clients...


Quote
However, Vince is right that you are depending on the device providing the access point for all the devices to talk to each other. I have a FlightBox and have built a couple of Stratux devices. I do not find them very reliable. I've lost a few SD cards, and if you don't have the right USB cable, you can have all kinds of reliability issues. To me, these are cool toys, kludged together from several general-purpose components (Raspberry Pi computer, software defined radios, etc.). They use a lot of power and have many failure points at each interconnection. I might trust a purpose built portable, like a Stratus or Sentry, but I don't trust a Stratux derivative to be a reliable network access point that all my other devices would have to depend on for interconnection.
I built and have been using my dual "in" Flightbox for several years now with FF and have found it to be very reliable over that time. I have it on ships power so power is not really an issue...I've really not had any problems with it since upgrading it with remote GPS, remote hi-gain antennas, AHRS and the new software to support that feature.

Truth be known...my flying over the last several years has declined to a point that I rarely find myself building flight plans and so if I loose the wifi connection I'm confident it wouldn't ruin my day!

I do appreciate the advise...I'll do some research on how to setup the IFD to connect to the Flightbox.

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HenryM View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 2:37pm
There's a setting for the IFD to set it in remote WiFi mode. You enter the Flightbox network name and the the IFD can connect to that network. 

I can't remember of the top of my head, but it might be in one of the maintenance settings. It is is pretty easy once you get to the right setting screen. 

My FlightBox has died, either with the SD card needing replacement or needing to reseat various components. I haven't tried to rebuild it since the last time it died in my plane. I have a certified ADS-B In box, so I don't really need a portable device anymore. 

It gets pretty hot here in Texas so maybe that has something to do with the problems I've had both with the flightbox and other Stratux boxes. If the USB cable is not thick enough, the voltage drop by the amount of current used makes the RPi not boot properly. If you have the right cable, it works fine. Overall, Iprefer purpose-built boxes, even if they cost a bit more. 

I have one of the early boxes with the initial AHRS board. I think the newer one is better. 

When the box works, it works well and has good reception with the high gain antennas. It just isn't all that reliable for me. Breaking once a year or every 6 months means highly unreliable to me. It usually happened when I actually needed it the most. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 4:22pm
What exactly is the advantage to using a Stratus or Stratux (etc) as a WiFi remote instead of the IFD as the source.  The IFD cannot take the traffic and weather from the Stratus anyway so it is really only the IPad that is receiving the ADS-B weather which it could receive from the IFD as well (assuming the aircraft has ADS-B IN).  What am I missing with this ability to make a Stratus the remote WiFi?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 4:33pm
If you don't have ADS-B In for your IFD, using a Stratus as the access point allows you to get traffic and weather + AHRS information on Foreflight, while at the same time letting the IFD transfer data to and from FF, FlyQ or other EFBs with the feature. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2020 at 6:01pm
That makes sense.  I had wrongly assumed that those setting up the Stratus as a remote Wifi, had ADS-B IN so I didn't the advantage.  This gives those without a certified ADS-B IN the ability to use the IFD 100 and FF and still get weather.  Got it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 5:36am
YouTube to the rescue!

I found this link which explains how to connect the IFD to a 3rd party WiFi network which will at least allow the IFD to accept flight plan transfers to/from the IPAD.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wA32exkEoO0

This is exactly what I was looking for...

Because my uAvionix tail beacon is not wired to my IFD...I currently don't have a way to get traffic or weather into the IFD. Until I can determine my best route, I'll continue using my Flightbox with the Ipad & Foreflight to get traffic & weather with the additional ability to push flight plans back and forth from the Ipad/FF & IFD540. I think I'll also be able to use the IFD100 app if I elect to do so....

I'll get everything setup and talking in the next few days and report back on how it works out for me.

Edited by rangerb3 - 07 Jun 2020 at 5:39am
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HenryM View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 8:39am
Doesn't Tailbeacon provide its own WiFi network? If you connect to it, then you won't need the portable unit anymore (unless you really like its AHRS). FF could get it's traffic and weather from Tailbeacon and talk to the IFD. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bob H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 8:49am
Originally posted by rangerb3 rangerb3 wrote:

Because my uAvionix tail beacon is not wired to my IFD...I currently don't have a way to get traffic or weather into the IFD.
The uAvionix tailBeacon is ADS-B out only.  It has no capability to provide traffic or weather in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 8:56am
My mistake. I thought the uAvionix products provided both ADS-B In and Out. 

Edited by HenryM - 07 Jun 2020 at 8:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 9:58am
Originally posted by HenryM HenryM wrote:

Doesn't Tailbeacon provide its own WiFi network? If you connect to it, then you won't need the portable unit anymore (unless you really like its AHRS). FF could get it's traffic and weather from Tailbeacon and talk to the IFD. 
The tailbeacon does have it's own WiFi network but it's only used to communicate with the beacon to make setup changes. To my knowledge, it cannot be used to push traffic data to anything. Too bad though but...Even if it did, I'd still need the Flightbox for ads-b "in" to get weather.

The tailbeacon was a quick and easy stop-gap to meet the 2020 mandate but, as I'm realizing now...it does have it's drawbacks in the fact that it doesn't interface or supply ads-b traffic data to any other devices in your airplane!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chflyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 10:43am
I don't consider the tailbeacon to be a stop-gap, and wouldn't down-play quick and easy. It was designed to do one thing well at a very attractive price point (purchase + installation). Those aren't necessarily drawbacks and may be considered advantages.

Sure, there are other devices like the Garmin GTX and L3 Lynx which are do-everything boxes which could also qualify as a drawback, and also come with various flavours. In any case they don't meet everyone's wants, needs, or budgets.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 4:01pm
Originally posted by chflyer chflyer wrote:

I don't consider the tailbeacon to be a stop-gap, and wouldn't down-play quick and easy. It was designed to do one thing well at a very attractive price point (purchase + installation). Those aren't necessarily drawbacks and may be considered advantages.

Sure, there are other devices like the Garmin GTX and L3 Lynx which are do-everything boxes which could also qualify as a drawback, and also come with various flavours. In any case they don't meet everyone's wants, needs, or budgets.
Maybe I should have worded it a little different...

I'm not unhappy with the tail beacon but, now that I've upgraded to a larger, more feature-rich panel display than my previous 430W, it would be nice to be able to leverage all of it's capabilities in regards to traffic, weather, and wifi connectivity.

The tail beacon "was" a quick & easy upgrade and, yes it's very good at doing it's job. At that time, It was a much more attractive upgrade considering my other options...I'm just starting to see now that my decision to go, "quick & easy" could have been better thought out! Hindsight is a PIA!

I still have the option to remove the beacon for something different when and if I decide to go down that road. Also, I may do nothing and continue using my portable setup...I'm pretty happy with what it gives me(redundancy) compared to the IFD.

Edited by rangerb3 - 07 Jun 2020 at 4:04pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bob H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 4:41pm
Originally posted by rangerb3 rangerb3 wrote:

Maybe I should have worded it a little different...

I'm not unhappy with the tail beacon but, now that I've upgraded to a larger, more feature-rich panel display than my previous 430W, it would be nice to be able to leverage all of it's capabilities in regards to traffic, weather, and wifi connectivity.
I'm planning to install an Avionix tailBeacon in a small taildragger for local flights.  Considering the aircraft only has a portable radio, the tailBeacon is a nice and cost effective ADS-B option to meet the mandate.  It's a nice unit and as already stated does its job very well.  However, I don't understand your statement: "it would be nice to be able to leverage all of it's capabilities..."  That statement belies the understanding that you already are leveraging ALL of its capabilities.  It has no capability beyond ADS-B out.  You can't leverage a capability that doesn't exist.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 6:24pm
Bob,
I was talking about leveraging the full capabilities of my new IFD540 by being able to integrate traffic & weather onto it's big screen. The tail beacon should work very well for anyone who doesn't care about being able to, "push" ads-b traffic and weather to any other avionics installed. The tail beacon is a great way to get 2020 compliant!

Edited by rangerb3 - 07 Jun 2020 at 6:27pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bob H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2020 at 6:33pm
Originally posted by rangerb3 rangerb3 wrote:

Bob, 
I was talking about leveraging the full capabilities of my new IFD540 by being able to integrate traffic & weather onto it's big screen. The tail beacon should work very well for anyone who doesn't care about being able to, "push" ads-b traffic and weather to any other avionics installed. The tail beacon is a great way to get 2020 compliant!
Ahh...sorry, I mis-read your post.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2020 at 12:37am
Today I tried connecting the IFD to my Flightbox but I never got the "transfer" icon in Foreflight.

I went into the IFD maint mode and added the Flightbox to the Networking section, re-booted the IFD into flight mode, went into Aux-Settings and pointed the IFD to use the Flightbox WiFi. The wifi symbol in the IDF went green and I verified that my Ipad running FF was connected to the Flightbox wifi. I never seen the "transfer" icon in the FF route section so, I re-booted FF. Still no joy.

I then setup the IFD to it's default wifi, pointed my Ipad to the same IFD wifi network and was then able to get the transfer icon in FF. Not sure why I wasn't able to get the transfer icon while connected to the Flightbox wifi network but, I know it was connected because the green wifi symbol in the top right corner of the IFD screen went green after a few minutes of connecting it to that network.

Anybody have any clues on what to do next?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2020 at 9:53pm
I got it figured out...

When I setup the wifi network in the Maintenance section I didn't change the type of network from Local Wifi to Remote wifi. Everything worked good when I made that change and I was then able to push & pull flight plans between Ipad/Foreflight and the IFD.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote steve.crimm@stephens Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jun 2020 at 3:38pm
Now with all of this back and forth...
Has anyone successfully connected the below together to a single wifi network
Dynon Skyview HDX
IFD440
IFD100
ForeFlight
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flybuddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jun 2020 at 2:32pm
Originally posted by rangerb3 rangerb3 wrote:



I went into the IFD maint mode and added the Flightbox to the Networking section,



How did you do that? Was Flightbox showing in the network config page or did you have to manually enter it? If manual, how did you get the tab, cursor down to the line below LIO to add it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 9:03pm
As i recall, there are two types of borders in those fields ...green & blue. Green allows you to edit the green highlighted field and blue allows you to move between the fields. 

I'm not sure I remember the exact steps but when you are in the Network section of the maintenance pages I think you roll the outer right knob and it will turn the border blue which allows you to cycle between the fields. Cycle it to an empty field and I think you then push the inner right knob which turns the border green allowing you to edit the field where you manually input the wifi network name. Its not like a phone or computer where it automatically shows available wifi networks. 

It was a little confusing at first because I kept pushing the inner right knob and it would put a green border around the field where you can edit the highlighted field. After you input the new wifi network in the left field, make sure you scroll to the field to the right and change it to "remote wifi" otherwise the IFD will be unable to connect to your remote network. LIO_WiFi is the IFD's own internal network and as such, the field to its right is called "local wifi."

I finally found out how to input my flight box wifi network by trial-n-error method. In fact, I was on hold with Avidyne tech support when I accidentally found out how to get to an empty field. 

In order to actually connect your IFD to your newly accessible remote wifi network,  reboot the IFD into flight mode, push the AUX button, move to the Setup tab and scroll down to the WiFi Networks field. Either turn the outer knob or maybe push the inner knob and turn the outer knob to change the network to your new remote network. Be patient because the connection is not instant...it took my IFD between 1 to 3 min to finally connect to my flight box network. You'll know it's connected when the wifi icon in the top right of the IFD screen turns green. 

Sorry, I'm working all these steps from memory...


Edited by rangerb3 - 14 Jun 2020 at 9:40pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jun 2020 at 9:34pm
Setting up the Wifi was originally only in the maintenance manual, and that is now only available to shops. But, I believe the Wifi setup has now been added to the PG, or there is an addendum.

* Orest
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flybuddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jun 2020 at 7:20am
 rangerb3 - Thx Much!! That worked...It's the left large knob that let's you move the field and then you push the right small one to enter characters. It starts on upper case and you have to cycle through all the upper case, then numbers to get to lower case inputs. Stratux doesn't appear to have a password so I left center box empty and right box I changed to remote wifi. After saving and reboot I went to user options and changed network to stratux.


Edited by Flybuddy - 15 Jun 2020 at 9:34am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rangerb3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jun 2020 at 8:00pm
Glad you got it figured out! I don't even remember using the left knob...but, if that's what it takes, good for ya! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flybuddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jun 2020 at 12:10pm
Thx...flew with it today and is working well!
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