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Garmin G5 and IFD 540 |
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Gring 
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Joined: 30 Dec 2011 Location: Kingston, NY Status: Offline Points: 737 |
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 Posted: 02 Feb 2018 at 1:11pm |
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Well, yes, obviously. The GFC500 requires the installation of the G5 and won't even work with a G500 PFD
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arkvet
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Posted: 02 Feb 2018 at 5:26pm |
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Thanks so much. After having read many many discussions on the topic this more concisely answers my questions than anything I've ran across. Exactly what I was looking for. |
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Brent
PA32-301 IFD550 / AXP322 / SkyTrax100 / Dual G5's / GFC 500 / JPI 830 |
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Catani
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Posted: 02 Feb 2018 at 6:28pm |
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OK, my question remains unanswered then. Unless I hear otherwise, I tentatively conclude the 430/530 can be swapped out with an IFD 440/540, and everything that worked with the 430/530 will work with the IFD 440/540, apart from the items mentioned by Gring. Just to be clear, I don't believe Avidyne has advertised that the IFD 440/540 is compatible with any other upgrade you might install in your panel at the same time you swap out the 430/530. The plug 'n play claim says only that the IFD is compatible with equipment the 430/530 is compatible with - which might now need a temporary asterisk given Gring's info until the IFDs can catch up to the modifications recently made to the 430/530 software. I suppose there will always be a lag between Garmin's 430/530 software upgrades, and the corresponding ones for the IFDs.
Edited by Catani - 02 Feb 2018 at 6:32pm |
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Gring
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Posted: 02 Feb 2018 at 6:39pm |
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Do you know if Garmin is addressing the need for dual ARINC429 ports on the G5 side, or the GNS530/430 side? If the latter, then I would think Avidyne will need to make the corresponding change.
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dwbarnett
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Posted: 03 Feb 2018 at 5:46pm |
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Hmm, based on the info I’m reading, doesn’t look like an interface for my IFD 440 and a G5 will be here any time
soon, if ever. I would really like to get rid of my analog stuff, but I like the GPSS, especially in a heavy workload IFR environment. I love my 440, but based on the track record of releases for software upgrades, don’t see a resolution anytime soon. Might have to go to Plan B, look at the Aspen setup. Concerned though, as I have heard Aspen is struggling in the market somewhat Optimally for me would be dual G5 with GPSS, and ESI500 for backup Hoping Avidyne can get things squared away soon. Best, David |
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chflyer
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Posted: 03 Feb 2018 at 5:56pm |
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Not related to the G5, but you might want to check the BeechTalk forum thread regarding a fellow who had issues pulling a G* 530W and plugging an IFD540 in conjunction with an Aspen 1000 Pro & G* GTX345. A bit specific to the 345, but nonetheless shows how important it is to not make assumptions. |
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Vince
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oskrypuch
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Posted: 03 Feb 2018 at 6:24pm |
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Hmm, based on Gring's and compasst posts, it appears that these are indeed working together now. But personally I think an ASPEN 1000 Pro is a better option than twin G5's anyway, and it is not much more. * Orest Edited by oskrypuch - 08 Feb 2018 at 10:51am |
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compasst
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Posted: 04 Feb 2018 at 6:27am |
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Last I heard from Garmin, the ARINC429 port consolidation was being done with software update for the GNS 430/530 and was to be completed mid-December. I've not been able to get confirmation of that. It was being done because some folks use one of these ports for other inputs from other devices. It was not clear if the G5 would also be changed. As of yesterday, G5 version 5.0 is still current from mid-December and my G5s still work fine with my IFD 540.
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jwjenks
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Posted: 08 Feb 2018 at 9:51am |
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Likewise. My G5 works perfectly with my 550.
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JWJ
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compasst
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Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 10:42am |
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I have answers from Garmin - the GAD 29 is different internally from the GAD 29B. Therefore, a GAD 29 cannot be upgraded to a GAD 29B by software.
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compasst
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Posted: 09 Feb 2018 at 10:52am |
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Per email from Garmin tech yesterday - the new software for GNS 5xx is version 5.4. This new software will not be required for G5 units to work properly. And, the G5 software will not be changed to require this GNS 5xx software change, so the G5 will still work with all its features when connected to IFD units. FYI, G5 software was just updated to v5.1. It appears it was fix in version 5.4 in the GNS 5XX software. You will need to go to a Garmin Dealer for the sw upgrade.
GNS 400W/500W Series Main Software v5.40 includes the following: • Added support for GFC 500 • Added ARINC 429 input for G5 • Fixed issue where FIS-B METARs and TAFs may not be displayed if too many are received • Fixed issue related to importing/export flight plans with IAF waypoints and procedure transition waypoints (and) The fix is in the GNS 5.4 software. The G5 will not require a software upgrade but I still suggest upgrading it to sw 5.1. The STC'd G5 software posted on Garmin site is still on 5.0. The fellow who wrote to me above is in the experimental wing, so their software might well be at v5.1 I also learned that having the Flight Director bars shown on G5 without benefit of an installed autopilot is NOT possible because the G5 gets that signal from a component of the compatible autopilot or from a separate box that could be installed. I'm still going to hope that the G500 autopilot gets an STC for Cessna Cardinal airplanes. |
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Flying_Monkey
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Posted: 20 Feb 2018 at 9:38pm |
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Let me guess..still no update... (sigh)
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AviTJ
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Posted: 21 Feb 2018 at 10:53am |
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The IFD does work with the G5. Truth be told, we already accept all of the 429 labels via the GAD42 configuration (the ability the GNS update gives). The time consuming part of this is getting it added to our installation manual, which requires amending the STC. As others have mentioned there are quite a few of these flying around already. Showing the IFD vs GNS as "like equipment" shouldn't be difficult for 337 purposes.
We can't make any promises about the G brand autopilot integration with G5's yet.
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khuffine
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Posted: 04 Mar 2018 at 10:43pm |
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Order a deklin aiu 900 for the go between the g5 and autopilot. Does a great job with gad29 b
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Khuffine
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Slatye
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Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 5:39am |
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I'm just about to connect a dual G5 (plus GMU-11 and GAD-29B) setup to an IFD540, but would someone mind checking the connections/settings for me? Other hardware in the system is a Bendix-King KT74 transponder, STEC 50 autopilot, and Garmin GI-106A nav indicator. What I've gathered from reading the installation manuals is:
IFD540 settings for the G5s: IFD540 settings for the KT-74: IFD540 settings for the GI-106A: Two futher questions: (1) Do I need to connect the IFD540 VOR/ILS ARINC429 input to the
GAD-29B too? The IFD540 manual shows connections for the Aspen systems,
and their airdata output only goes to the GPS ARINC 429 input section. However, the G5 install manual shows the ARINC 429 connection going to both GPS and VOR/ILS sections on a GNS-530W. (2) Is there any way to have the G5 output its altitude data to the KT-74? I’ve got an altitude encoder, but if I can dump that and rely on the G5’s internal encoder then that saves weight and wiring, as well as ensuring that the G5 and the KT-74 agree. Thanks for any help! |
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Cruiser
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Posted: 12 Mar 2018 at 6:53pm |
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how do you get one of those approved for certified aircraft?
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bcool
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Posted: 19 Apr 2018 at 12:19am |
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For those of you with the G5 HSI, can you use the IFD540's VOR signal for a bearing pointer? Or, do you have to connect to a 2nd radio to get that?
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khuffine
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Posted: 21 Apr 2018 at 11:33pm |
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Bearing pointer works only with the number one navigator. Select. Vor and it is the blue pointer on hsi.
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Khuffine
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Gary L
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Posted: 01 Jul 2018 at 5:03pm |
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I see that the G-5 now has s/w version 5.30 available. Any pireps on it?
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Quilpie
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Posted: 28 Sep 2018 at 3:36pm |
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Did you get an answer to this? I have installed a G5 with twin IFD440s, a GAD29B, GMU-11 magnometer, STEC-50 A/P and a ki206 indicator. I have the no2 IFD440 connected to the KI206 and was hoping to connect no1 IFD440 to the G5 and use the G5s functionality/flight director to give me a second CDI/glide slope but unfortunately it’s not working. Clearly something hasn’t been installed correctly but I don’t know what. The answer to your question will lie,ly be the answer to mine. Also is there an easy way to determine if gpss steering is working on my STEC-50?
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chflyer
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Posted: 03 Oct 2018 at 9:50pm |
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Has anyone installed a single G5 as AI with an IFD? I‘m not sure this config is supported, but chapter 5.12 of the G5 IM shows how this would/could work. BTW, anyone know what Garmin means by ADI? I can‘t find any definition of this acronym. It would need an GAD29 (don‘t need 29B if no a/p interface), but would provide ADC data like baro-alt to the IFD via ARINC 429.
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Vince
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rpostmo
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Posted: 04 Oct 2018 at 8:58pm |
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Yes. IFD-540 with G5 AI. It works flawlessly. If the King HSI fails, it will be replaced by a G5 HSI.
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chflyer
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Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 1:17pm |
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Including providing ADC info such as baro-altitude to the IFD via Arinc? I can‘t find any details of the Arinc data output by the G5 nor if that is accepted by the IFD (IM only lists specific ADC devices, and of course the G5 is not one of them).
Edited by chflyer - 06 Oct 2018 at 1:18pm |
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Vince
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rpostmo
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Posted: 06 Oct 2018 at 6:12pm |
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I can't answer that. My baro data is supplied by a Shadin Digidata to the IFD. Bob
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paulr
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Posted: 07 Oct 2018 at 12:20pm |
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I'd like to know this too-- considering adding an ADC along with the G5 or Aspen units but would love to skip it if possible.
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Bob H
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Posted: 13 Oct 2018 at 10:37pm |
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G5 AI works great with the IFD. It does not ouput any Baro data.
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Bob
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chflyer
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Posted: 14 Oct 2018 at 12:05pm |
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Bob, I assume that you mean the G5 receives data from the IFD via the RS-232 GPS connection. I'm guessing that most (all?) IFD installations with the G5 use this. Per the Garmin G5 IM, this is a one-way data flow and the wiring details are in section 5.4 of the G5 IM.
I'm not 100% certain, but I don't think any device outputs baro-altitude across RS-232, and the standard ADC's use ARINC 429 for this. However, the G5 AI can output data on the CAN bus to another Garmin device such as the GAD29, and the GAD29 supports ARINC 429. There is a diagram in the G5 IM section 5.12 showing a single G5 ADI (whatever that is) with connection to a GPS/VHF navigator. This diagram shows ARINC 429 data output from the G5 AI flowing via CAN bus to GAD29 and then ARINC 429 to the 430W/530W. I believe this would get baro-altitude from the G5 to the IFD, and for less cost than an ADC. Since AviTJ mentioned that the IFD does accept the 429 inputs from a GAD42 (assumed in a config with G5 HSI), I would expect that this would also work. But I would love to hear if someone has done it.
Edited by chflyer - 14 Oct 2018 at 12:12pm |
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Vince
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Bob H
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Posted: 14 Oct 2018 at 7:47pm |
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My G5 is installed in a certificated aricraft which required installation in accordance with Garmin's Part 23 AML STC. That STC includes the below information. I do not know what is allowed for non-certificated aircraft.  |
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Bob
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chflyer
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Posted: 15 Oct 2018 at 1:57am |
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What document are you quoting, Bob? I am looking at the very latest version of the G5 Part 23 AML STC IM 190-01112-10 Rev 14, dated July 2018, and there is no section 1.7.1.3, only 1.7.1.1 and 1.7.1.2 on p21 and then section 2 on p22.
It looks like that restriction has been removed, which would be necessary for consistency with the approved ADI configuration in section 5.12 mentioned above which I believe was added in Rev 12. Edited by chflyer - 15 Oct 2018 at 2:01am |
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Vince
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Bob H
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Posted: 15 Oct 2018 at 9:12am |
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Bob
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Paul
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Posted: 20 Mar 2019 at 4:33pm |
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We have a Cessna with an IFD 540 and a KI 209A. I'm considering replacing the AI and DG and the G5 is an obvious choice. However the G5 installation manual says "THIS STC DOES NOT APPROVE A CDI INTERFACED WITH THE SAME NAVIGATOR AS THE G5. REMOVE ANY EXISTING CDI INTERFACED WITH THIS NAVIGATOR." The KI 209A is installed as part of the Avidyne STC. Do we really have to remove it if we install a G5?
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migs
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Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 11:04am |
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We have two IFD540 units with a G5 HSI and a Bendix/King KAP140 two-axis autopilot with altitude pre-select. Most functions work, but the autopilot cannot track a VOR course. It seems that Avidyne may not be aware of this issue, so I will give a little description. Before we installed the G5 we used to have a Bendix/King KI-525A HSI. We replaced it with a G5, which comes with the GAD29A. All other autopilot modes work well: heading mode, GPSS roll steering, NAV mode on GPS courses, NAV mode on GPS OBS mode, APR mode on ILS (with both LOC and GS tracking), REV mode for the LOC BC, APR mode on GPS (both lateral modes and modes with vertical guidance, such as LPV with GP tracking). The only mode that does not work is NAV mode tracking a VOR course. Note that the G5 displays the selected VOR course and the course deviation correctly, but the autopilot is not receiving the course deviation signal. My understanding of the problem is that IFD is the one responsible for computing the course deviation and sending it to the autopilot. The IFD expects to receive the course selection as an analog signal from the HSI (that's how the KI-525A worked), but the G5 does not provide such signal. The course selection is sent to the IFD digitally on the ARINC 429 bus, but the IFD does not use it. I am curious to hear if anybody else is experiencing a similar issue, and what Avidyne knows/thinks of it. |
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teeth6
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Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 8:12pm |
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It may be different with your autopilot but I have a King autopilot also (KFC 150) and when I looked into getting a G5, I was told that my autopilot wasn’t compatible.
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Paul
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Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 8:18pm |
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The KFC 150 is supported with the G5 using the GAD 29B adapter.
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teeth6
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Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 8:31pm |
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Interesting. This is what I was told by an avionics tech: ”I would not expect to see autopilot interfaces on the G5 anytime for any analog autopilot (such as a KFC150) in the near futire.”
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Paul
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Posted: 18 Apr 2019 at 9:18pm |
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Predicting the future is hard work. I think a lot of people were surprised when Garmin announced the GAD 29B. It connects the G5 to the common Century, BK, and S-TEC autopilots.
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teeth6
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Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 5:59pm |
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From what I’m told the GAD 29B connects the G5 to the KFC 150 but the G5 only supports heading and course error, mimicking the KI HSI. G5 is not emulating pitch and roll input for KFC150 so saying the G5 supports the KFC 150 is only partially true from what I’ve been told. Plus in my plane, I’d have to maintain the vacuum driven AI anyway.
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TogaDriver
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Posted: 19 Apr 2019 at 7:01pm |
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We have a G5 HSI, GAD29B, IFD 440, and KFC-150. You must retain the KI-256 vacuum A/I for the KFC-150. The G5 HSI replaces the KI525A HSI and drives the KFC-150 in HDG mode only.
The KFC-150 will follow the G5 HDG bug or, if the G5 is set to GPSS mode, the KFC-150 will follow the GPS ARINC data supplied by the IFD when on HDG mode. If you put the KFC-150 into NAV or APR mode it uses the analog wiring direct from the IFD (P1001 Connector as per Figure D-26 IFD install manual) to drive the autopilot. It works very well and was not much more than the cost to overhaul the KI-525A/KG-102 combo that was failing. Edited by TogaDriver - 19 Apr 2019 at 7:03pm |
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migs
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Posted: 23 Apr 2019 at 12:23pm |
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If you tune a VOR on the IFD, set the IFD to VLOC mode, select a radial in the G5 HSI, can you set the autopilot in NAV mode? Does it track the radial? In our installation the IFD does not provide the analog course deviation signal to the autopilot (P1001 connector) when the IFD is in VLOC and tuned to a VOR. It does work when tuned to an ILS.
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ChainSaw
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Posted: 05 May 2019 at 11:33am |
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TogaDriver, Congrats with the successful IFD440-Gad29b-G5 integration. Please let us know who did your install . I have an IFD 440 and desire to replace my vacuum DG with the G5 HSI to drive hdg for the Century 21 AP. Avionics support at my home field is not available. II would fly to the experienced installer or pay airfare and hotel for a few days for that installer to travel to my location.
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chflyer
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Posted: 09 Aug 2023 at 11:04am |
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I have a G5/GMU11/GAD29B connected to my IFD540 via Arinc 429 and RS232 (G5 input only, no output to IFD).
I also have a Sandel SN3500 with all the associated boxes for heading (KMT112/KG102A/MD26-28). The SN3500 currently provided heading to the IFD via Arinc 429 and to my WX-500 via XYZ. I now plan to replace my Stec30 a/p with a GFC500 and the SN3500/G5 no longer mix well so I'll replace the SN3500 (and all associated boxes) with a 2nd G5 at the same time. This raises questions about how to source heading to the WX-500. The IFD will need to get its heading from the G5/GMU11/GAD29B rather than the SN3500. I don't see any problem with that. I'm presently having a conversation with Avidyne tech support about whether the IFD will relay the heading information that it receives over Arinc 429 to the WX-500 on a RS232 output port. I'm being told that the answer is that the IFD DOES NOT output heading information to the WX-500 over RS232. However people on the Beechtalk forum say that this is operational and works well with a GNS unit rather than IFD. So is the IFD not really plug-compatible with the GNS530 in this case? |
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Vince
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compasst wrote: